»Making music is not only following instructions written on a score by a composer, it’s also playing with sound, creating something personal, finding our voice through the instrument we chose«.
German saxophonist and clarinetist Edith Steyer and Italian guitarist Francesca Naibo took part in the ten-day international Better Live tour in October, which led them through Slovenia, Croatia and Italy. In this conversation, they reflect on playing music together for the first time, encountering different music scenes, and why free improvisation has become central to their artistic expression.
In October you attended a ten-day international Better Live tour across Slovenia, Croatia and Italy. What would you highlight from this tour? Which concert venues did you find particularly interesting?
ES: The most interesting for me were the City of Women Festival at Stara mestna elektrarna in Ljubljana, Štala in Lokavec, Scena Ribnjak in Zagreb, Hangar Teatri in Trieste and Dobialab in Staranzano.
FN: Touring is a very special experience. The Better Live tour was special because it was longer than any tour I’d done before, and it allowed me to get in touch with venues and people I had never met. Each place had a unique atmosphere that directly reflected the care people put into it. It’s not always about how big, modern or clean a venue is, it’s really about the energy you find inside a space and how the community brings it to life.
As an artist, you have to quickly understand each vibe and adapt to it. Sometimes it’s challenging, sometimes it makes you feel so comfortable. My highlight is the vividness and variety of these different vibes, which are still very clear in my memory, and how the music Edith and I played resonated in each space and with each audience. It’s hard to choose one special venue, as I’d like to highlight how special each place is, but I’d like to mention our final concert in Staranzano. After ten days we knew each other pretty well, there was a strong sense of trust and also that bittersweet feeling of a shared experience coming to an end. We dedicated the concert to a mentor of Edith who had recently passed away, so the emotions were strong. The night at Dobialab was enriched by a very friendly atmosphere that I found truly unique.
You played together for the first time on this tour, right? How did you experience playing with each other?
ES: Yes, it was our first time. For me it was a pleasure. I think we needed a few concerts to fully understand each other’s musical language. I also had different setups, sometimes acoustic, sometimes electronic. Since my luggage was lost by the airline for four days, I had to play acoustically at the beginning because my electronic equipment was in the suitcase. But I think we mastered the situation well. And by the way, I enjoy playing acoustically too.
FN: Playing for the first time with someone you’ve never met is a great challenge. I have very nice memories of how our musical relationship developed over the tour. The first night was very much about discovering each other’s sounds and possibilities, leaving room for each other and welcoming whatever musical proposals we felt like sharing. As the tour went on, we went deeper and deeper, ending the last concert with an intimate connection that is still very clear in my mind. I feel the tour allowed us to truly connect and to always stay present. It’s so important to always be ready, playful and willing to take risks, trusting each other throughout. Playing so many concerts with Edith was truly a unique experience.
And what was it like to collaborate with other local musicians in the different venues?
ES: Most of the time I had good experiences. It’s important to perform with musicians who are on a similar level. Only once did I feel that our co-musician didn’t feel quite there, which made things a bit difficult.
FN: We were lucky to play with very different musicians, so each collaboration created a unique sonic experience. Each of them had a very personal musical interest, sound and character. We met very open-minded people and had a lot of fun playing with them. I intentionally avoided listening to their recordings beforehand, so that I would have no expectations, just fresh ears and an open mind.
Would you take part in a similar tour again?
ES: Yes, for sure.
FN: Totally. It was an amazing experience and opportunity. I think Zavod Sploh, its partners and the Better Live project are creating precious opportunities for experimental artists, and I hope it will continue for many years.
What do you think about the Slovenian free improvised music scene?
ES: I think there are many good artists in the country, and I hope they can continue to expand the improvised music scene even more.
FN: I was very surprised to find so many different realities, venues and most of all musicians in such a small country. I have the impression that a lot is happening in Slovenia, many people choose to dedicate their lives to the arts, and society seems to give space to that. Discovering your scene gave me a lot of enthusiasm, energy and the desire to maintain the connections I established and, hopefully, to return soon for new collaborations.
What kind of relationship do you have with free improvised music?
ES: It is the centre of my work right now, after coming from jazz and classical music. I also compose sometimes, but I’d say that about 80–90% of my concerts are improvised.
FN: It is the music I’ve dedicated myself to for the past ten years, and I’m so passionate about it. It’s challenging, creative, personal and honest, and that’s why I like it so much. It fosters a direct and deep relationship with sound, and I feel alive when I improvise.
Why did you decide to play and practise free improvised music?
ES: I was tired of thinking harmonically, as in jazz, and of practising scales and chords all the time. I wanted to free myself, so I began preparing the saxophone and clarinet and developing my own instrumental language. I also got into extended techniques more and more. I like the hierarchy-free structures in improvised music. There is no leader, we work together and share the duties.
FN: I have a classical education, that I always enjoyed, but around the age of twenty I realised that without a score on my stand I felt lost. I decided I needed something different alongside my studies, as the classical approach didn’t fulfil the expressive needs I felt. Playing and practising free improvisation keeps my desire for sound, exploration and freshness alive. It prevents me from feeling like I’ve made it, it makes me question things, keeps me open to the unexpected, and most of all, it reminds me that the most important thing is to keep listening.
Have any well-known female or male musicians from this genre inspired you? Who and why?
ES: My biggest inspirations among famous musicians in recent years have been two clarinet players. John Carter, who was an American free jazz improviser and composer, and Theo Jörgensmann, a German improviser. Besides that, I work a lot with women and in all-female bands. There are many contemporary female improvisers in Berlin who work professionally and on a very high level, like Rieko Okuda, Sofia Borges, Mia Dyberg, Isabel Rößler, Céline Voccia, Hada Benedito and many more.
FN: Yes, many musicians have influenced my way of playing improvised music over the years. My first fundamental inspirations came from renowned guitarists such as Marc Ribot, Fred Frith, Elliott Sharp and Derek Bailey, because of their creativity and their desire to expand the guitar’s sound vocabulary. Later I became more and more receptive to improvisers on other instruments. I can mention many string players: the cellist Theresa Wong, the double bassists Daniel Studer and Joëlle Léandre, the cellist Alfred Zimmerlin, the violinist Harald Kimmig, the violist Frantz Loriot. All of them have very personal voices on their instruments, and I admire their lasting commitment to their work.
When you play and practise, how do you focus on exploring sound?
ES: As I mentioned, I work a lot with preparations, and for the past year or two also with electronics on the clarinet. There is so much to explore in both areas, it never stops. Altering sounds is one of my main goals. When I’ve explored that enough, I can come back to melodic material, chromatics or 12-tone improvisation.
FN: There is no rule I follow. Everything starts with listening, it’s the most important thing. I’ve been deepening my approach to listening through Deep Listening (a method created by Pauline Oliveros, I recently received certification for completing the official courses). It’s a never-ending process. I find it important not to settle, not to feel accomplished, and to always try to discover something new, a special tension in sound, emotion or surprise.
Would you include free improvisation in the curricula of public schools and music schools? Why?
ES: Yes, because it offers pupils a different entry into music: active listening and reacting come to the foreground, and the process can be more playful.
FN: Yes. In fact, I’m also a music teacher in Italian middle schools, and free improvisation and creative approaches to instruments are a regular part of the curriculum I plan every year. In the first four months, my students learn how to hold the guitar and basic technique, but they also explore the instrument’s full range of sounds, learn to use preparations, compose graphic scores and perform them in front of an audience. Making music is not only following instructions written on a score by a composer, it’s also playing with sound, creating something personal, finding our voice through the instrument we chose.
Thank you for your time.
